Impaled scythians (pics)

TZH · Post by **TZH** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 9:00 am

Hello

This photos were send me yesterday. The sender wrote they were made by an excavation, and are in situ. I don't think they are original.
Any opinions?

TZH

Russ Mitchell · Post by **Russ Mitchell** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:11 pm

Is this from the Hunnic burials out around Tapioszele, or somewhere else?

I'm afraid that with only those photos to go on, it's *really* hard to come up with any opinions on the question... I didn't see any glaring dealbreakers, but then, would you at that resolution?

Don't know.

TZH · Post by **TZH** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 8:09 am

Hello

Noo, the oldest mummys in Hungary were found in church crypts from the early 18th century:-))

I think these were (if not original) parts of a film scenery. But they look (frightening) real.
But: if they were found "in situ" (somewhere in Siberia, or in Altay etc), and frozen, f.e. the heads of the pales (specially the one in the right) should had been as dark as the other parts of the wood, and the goryth is on the wrong side and high.

Zolt

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:40 pm

I agree with Zolt?n. These look like sculptures or mock ups for a movie. Considerable distortion occurs with both standard burials and in the frozen burials. These look like imaginative reconstructions of what someone thought these figures would look like.

jack farrell · Post by **jack farrell** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:21 pm

I think it was Rolle who wrote about this practice among the Scythians of the Black Sea area.

After the death and burial of an important Scythian, certain warriors were chosen or volunteered to accompany the deceased to the next life. These warriors were strangled (a less ominous death, not requiring the shedding of blood) and impaled upon the back of an erect, impaled horse on the top of the kurgan in the form of a military escort. Halved cart wheels also supported the horses. These were not buried in the kurgan.

So this image would represent these warriors possibly one year later.

A gorytus was not usually worn on the back but could conceiviably be carried in any manner desired. Jack

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:00 pm

The original reference was Herodotus who documented the burial customs of the so called Royal Scythians.

Stephen Selby · Post by **Stephen Selby** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:54 am

Having worked with some of the world's best-preserved mummies, I have doubts. The articulation of the corpses (both man and horse) and the perfect alignment of the bow, which remains strung in the quiver, seem to me impossible. Preservation of mummies requires either wet conditions without oxygen or extremely dry conditions. In wet conditions, the flesh may remain intact but the bones gradually lose ridgidity and the body structure collapses. In extreme dry conditions, the bow and the bodies would deform due to tissue shrinkage following loss of water from the body structure.

Peter Dekker · Post by **Peter Dekker** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:54 pm

The "too good to be true" factor is indeed rather high on these pics!

I make traditional Chinese rattan shields that are considered very light but even those easily weigh 2200 grams.

I can't imagine the guy's arm would be able to hold that position for so long with a weight like that on it. This shield seems to consist of wood and metal which is bound to be much heavier than my rattan. I would expect it to have pulled the arm down more, if not pull it off completely when the body is decaying.

And eeh, do I see a window with trees behind it on the left of the last pic? It looks like it is standing in some kind of modern building.

-Peter