Spencer Rodgers article (3-finger draw in China)

Uli · Post by **Uli** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:58 pm

very interesting pictures !
what does the text say about these two bow types ?
do you also think that the big bow belly is meant to perspectively show the tapering of the limb width twds grip and siyahs ?

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 4:32 pm

Let me ask a friend for help with translating the description of the two bows. The perspective of the drawing looks to have been rotated a bit (it doesn't look like a full side-on perspective).

The bow on the left reminds me of the Grozer Hunnish model. The long-siyah bows with straight handles have also appeared in several Song dynasty (10--13th century AD) paintings.

jiao · Post by **jiao** » Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:02 pm

at the end of text , the two bow one is red bow other is black bow

Justin Ma, after han dynasty the long siyah huns bows still exist in china cause the south huns peace and friends so many year till to Europe huns game over, almost same time, you can find what about the south huns in chinese history

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:06 pm

I wasn't sure whether I should spawn a new thread for the following, but I figured it would be good to keep the discussion of the Chinese finger draw in one thread.

So I stumbled across this, which is supposed to be a Chinese "ring" meant for the finger draw (in this case, a 2-finger draw). I'm unsure about the date and exact origin, but I sent an email message to the owner asking about it: http://antiferus.net/collection/chinese3.htm

Has anyone else seen a Chinese finger draw device like this before?

WarBow · Post by **WarBow** » Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:53 am

http://www.youtube.com/user/garvonfamil ... 8G7WqyVg3c

Both devices are similar in functionality.

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Mon Jul 11, 2011 6:55 am

Uli wrote: very interesting pictures !
what does the text say about these two bow types ?

The label for the bow on the left is "black bow", the label for the bow on the right is "red bow". The text from Xin Ding San Li Tu 新定三礼图 paraphrases a passage from the Rites of Zhou 周礼 --- specifically, the passage that is quoted in Selby's "Chinese Archery" paragraph 6A17.

It describes bows of three different lengths (6 chinese feet and 6 chinese inches, 6 feet and 3 inches, and 6 feet). And it describes their "circumference" or presumably some draw length descriptor, which is 9 for the emperor, 7 for higher level officials, and 5 for lower level officials.

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:44 am

Just going over some earlier ATARN threads showing Han dynasty (206 BC -- 220 AD) artwork that could be interpreted as archers shooting with the finger draw.

http://atarn.net/phpBB2/files/han_draw_length_121.jpg
http://atarn.net/phpBB2/files/han_archer_top_481.jpg
http://www.fileden.com/files/2009/10/12 ... a_xa01.jpg

Other Han artwork also depict archers shooting with the thumb draw. But there's a tie-in with these three photos with the theory that Chu State (1030 -- 223 BC) archers shot with the finger draw. The ancestors of the Han dynasty royal family were from Chu, so people in the Western Han dynasty might have carried over some of their archery customs, particularly the black/brown silk-wrapped wooden composites and bamboo composites. If the Chu people did shoot 3-finger, then the 3-finger draw might have carried over to part of the Han dynasty.

My current estimate for when the finger draw fell entirely out of favor in China is some time between the end of Han and the beginning of the Ming dynasties (220--1368 AD).

Spencer Rodgers article (3-finger draw in China)

Two Finger Draw Release Aid