chinese thumb rings between Han and Qing

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:07 am

Stephen,
Do you mean the ring is only 6 mm deep? Thanks for the information.

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 am

Interesting. The opening of that ring would fit my thumb, but the lip is much shorter than the rings I try to make. Makes me want to experiment with short-lip rings.

JJ · Post by JJ » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:36 pm

What?s this? Sewing thimble again??

JJ

jack farrell · Post by **jack farrell** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:22 pm

Jurgen; Is this not the same ring from the Silk Road Museum?

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:39 pm

JJ wrote:What?s this? Sewing thimble again??

The white object in the back looks like Figure 9 of Bede's article on ancient Chinese thumb rings: http://www.atarn.org/chinese/thumbrings ... _rings.htm

JJ · Post by JJ » Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:12 pm

Yes Jack, it?s Silk Road Museum. Sorry if we discussed that already...

The thing behind it is a little strange, here?s another view of it (sorry for the bad picture quality).

JJ

Stephen Selby · Post by **Stephen Selby** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:51 am

Yes, these are thimbles: vital kit for people who relied on working with leather for survival. The jingle on the back of the bronze one is typical of the Sino-Korean north-eastern cultural zone. I don't have a thimble like these, but I have knot-picking and thread picking devices with similar designs from the Chifeng and Ningcheng areas, dating to around the 5th-3rdC BCE.

Justin Ma · Post by **Justin Ma** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:51 pm

This is probably old news to people, but I ran across a link to the University of Missouri thumb ring collections of Grayson and Browne. http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/online ... ring.shtml

With respect to this thread, the following cylindrical rings were dated to the 11th century ( http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/online ... nimal.shtm ) and 13th century ( http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/online ... signs.shtm ), which is roughly in the Song, Yuan and Ming dynasty time range. It is unclear whether these were actually Jurchen rings.

An interesting ring that might have been from the Ming dynasty (1368--1644) is a quasi-cylindrical design with a bump in the middle: http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/online ... tehat.shtm . It looks like the same type as one depicted in Bede's 2001 article: http://www.atarn.org/chinese/thumbrings/image09.gif

Stephen Selby · Post by **Stephen Selby** » Fri Apr 01, 2011 3:37 am

...the following cylindrical rings were dated to the 11th century ( http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/online ... nimal.shtm ) and 13th century ( http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/online ... signs.shtm ), which is roughly in the Song, Yuan and Ming dynasty time range.

I think these may be early Qing rings or pre-Qing Manchu rings. Unfortunately, there are neither archaeological examples or good illustrations to compare them to.

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:02 am

Stephen,
I think the dating on these rings is problematic. I discussed it with Grayson when he was alive and we came to the conclusion that they were likely to be modern (i.e 19th-20th century). There is a tendency to date objects by condition which leads to thinking the most degraded surfaces represent the oldest objects.