Choson Dynasty Hornbow in Museum

Dusan · Post by **Dusan** » Sat May 14, 2011 8:33 am

Pics what i mean is in this link, JJ.
http://www.sac.or.kr/eng/bows/bow.html
This is max what i know about old Korean bows...

JJ · Post by JJ » Sat May 14, 2011 9:47 am

I see it is necessary to go to Yeonsei Univerity Museum and Seoul National University Museum...

jack farrell · Post by **jack farrell** » Sun May 15, 2011 9:28 pm

JJ; No wonder I could not find the pics! Mea culpa. But those interested should copy the pics from the site Dusan has once again brought up. Who knows if this info may disappear?

maruchi · Post by **maruchi** » Thu May 19, 2011 4:04 pm

Thank you for your pics JJ.(please let me use your pics for my blog ^^)

The bow is similar to that of the Joseon's first king.(1335~1408 AD)

I think our ancestor used that shape of siyah(similar to arab, mongol etc) but later, changed the style(yet don't' know when), because it's easy to make and rigid.
bows in the musium of korean,(almost after late 19centuary~early 20c) shows evolution progressing.

and the quiver is to this military quiver(late 16c)...
but looks poor quality, and one piece.

I want to know how the french musium got the bow and quiver.

In 1866 , a french fleet invaded the Joseon, Ganghwa island(for reason of religion), and stoled many goods.
It can not exclude the bow and quiver are looted goods

If it's right, we can guess age of them!

anyway, thanks for safekeeping.

Uli · Post by **Uli** » Thu May 19, 2011 4:16 pm

interesting facts and picture !
darn, imagine those arrows at full draw on this small bow..

WarBow · Post by **WarBow** » Fri May 20, 2011 3:47 am

Yeah, at 100+# peak draw weight = awesome arrow trajectory!!!

Uli wrote:interesting facts and picture !
darn, imagine those arrows at full draw on this small bow..

Bede · Post by **Bede** » Fri May 20, 2011 7:47 am

The problem shooting light arrows with powerful bows is that unless the release is perfect the arrow leaves at an angle to its trajectory. This means a lot of the energy is used up straightening out the flight of the arrow and distance is reduced. Long draws, such as the Korean, are particularly susceptible to this problem. When you see arrows that seem so slender and long, it is an indication of the skill of the archers.

When you watch Korean traditional archers shoot, it is an opportunity to see how this problem can be overcome. Concentration and technique are the answer.

JJ · Post by JJ » Wed May 25, 2011 10:49 am

maruchi,

thanks for your comments and questions. This is for sure an exciting bow, as there are not many of these known and they leave a lot of questions.

Unfortunately the museum has no knowledge about the bow and it?s origins. In fact the bow is labeled inside the showcase as "Old Khirgis Bow". They say it comes from an old collection, but don?t know anything about how it was collected and brought to Europe.

It is remarkably similar to the bow on the B&W photograph of the bow that shall have belonged to King T?aejo, founder of Joseon dynasty in the 14th century. But how sure is this attribution? I think that it might be false. Artefacts are often mislabeled. Personally I wouldn?t believe that a bow type was built in exactly the same way over several centuries. On the other side the bow in France doesn?t look to me like a 600 years old bow. I would guess it to be max. 200 years old from it?s good state of preservation. Also I can?t imagine that the french bow could have belonged to a King, because the sinew layers are not covered by bark or leather. Also the repair patch on the end of one horn strip doesn?t look like it was made for a king. To me that seems to indicate that the bow in fact was a standard military bow.

The story about the french fleet attacking Ganghwa island in 1866 seems a logical explanation for the origin and dating of the bow.

I will try to see some of the other specimens of that bow type next time when I?m in Korea (at WTAF).

Maruchi asked for some more pictures, here we go

)

Detail of Nock with rayskin cover in string notch resembling turkish nocks

Ridge on "kasan"

string bridge

repair patch (I think this was already done during bow manufacture. I don?t believe the horn would break like this at this part of the bow.)

the quiver (at left a piece of the bowstring)...

JJ

ginni · Post by **ginni** » Wed May 25, 2011 11:56 am

JJ, the kassan ridge is shaped from wooden core or is made from sinew? The shape of the ridge is very unusual.

JJ · Post by JJ » Wed May 25, 2011 1:56 pm

Ginni, it is obviously carved into the wood. You?re right, it is the other way round like the ones we are used to (pointed end at knee, broad end in "kasan eye"

maruchi · Post by **maruchi** » Thu May 26, 2011 3:21 am

Thank you very very much JJ.

Your additional pics remind me some memories.

For hornbow we used two kinds of horn.

1. Blackhorn - it is long to reach siyah, import from other country, expensive, but it's basic manufacturing sytem is being countinued.

2. Countryhorn - it is shorter than blackhorn, korean country bull's horn, it was easy to get than blackhorn, but countryhornbow(향각궁/후궁hyanggakgung or hugung) it is difficult to produce than blackhornbow(흑각궁 /장궁hukgakgung or janggung) and performance, it can't reach blackhornbow, so it disappeared nowadays.

I think the bow used countryhorn.

Adam Karpowicz · Post by **Adam Karpowicz** » Thu May 26, 2011 9:04 am

Quite a bow, thanks for posting JJ.

The tips look as a "missing link" between the modern Korean and the Middle Eastern, while the carved ridge seems to have sinew only half way up. I think the bow has not been used much and was easily over a 100lb.

Adam

JJ · Post by JJ » Thu May 26, 2011 9:06 am

Maruchi,
I think you are right with the cow horn....

What?s your opinion on the "King T?aejo?s bow" and its datation? Do you know where it is?

maruchi · Post by **maruchi** » Thu May 26, 2011 2:55 pm

This black-and-white picture was taken late 19c or early 20c , maybe by japanise.
At that time, the bow was in Hamhung city north-korea, king taejo's native, he spent his last days after abdication.
I'm sorry but during the Korean-war, Hamhung was burned.
And now, South korean nobody knows about that.

If it exist, more 600 years..... after his demise(1408).... amazing!

As a matter of fact, I don't have a firm belief that the bow is taejo's,
without that simple picture, there is nothing remarks!
King taejo, he is the greatist archer ever i know, and he lived last Koryo(고려 origine of the Korea) periode.
The Koryo was influenced by the Mongol ; Yuan, and Hamhung city was near with Jurchen(여진yojin-they build Qing), they used big bow.
I know King taejo's rival general Choi-yong's big bow is in Japan's some temple. I'm really want to see the bow, to compare.

The other side, the bowcase, I'm sure it is king taejo's.

It is the same 15century old book's arabesque pattern.

jiao · Post by **jiao** » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:02 pm

JJ ,this is greet discovery
did you see the groove on the break horn?
http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk22 ... G_8105.jpg

the sinew back layer very same like adam's technique

Choson Dynasty Hornbow in Museum

What a suprise!